Orcishwarrior:PLease kindly transfer pictures and discussion (from NDP2010 thread).

gary1910: Just split the NDP2010 thread especially on the discussion of Leo 2A4 EVO and merged it into this thread.

Certainly IBD Evo, the side armour skirt is certainly from IBD as they are identical.

Or I should say Evo lite,remember that there was report that a potential customer was looking it with reduced weight.

Anyway, the turret armour do not have those slit in the original, I presume no AMAP-ADS, the top armour seem to have additional plate , not clear though, the hull bottom look different as well, perhaps with mine resistent plating added as well.

Wow!! Nice find, tks for posting.

The armour upgrade does not seem to have additional plating on the turret top, but the frontal & the sides of the turret look fxxking great, the hull was also very impressive with additional armour on the front as well as on the sides. with the back cover with Slat(cage) armour, certainly up for urban warfare!! B)

Mobile column , Zoom 200%

http://i49.tinypic.com/6f59j7.jpg

I think its getting more and more obvious that SAF is moving towards a 3G SAF emphasizing on Urban Warfare.

Examples are the SAF Urban Ops Training Facility, Advanced Combat Man System, BMS etc.

Those zhnged leos looks swee, is there a jane's article on the upgrade?

I think I could have made a mistake , from this picture , our Leo 2 armour upgrade could have additional armour plating at the turret top, only way to confirm is to have a clearer picture.

Finally, the video for the mobile column is up from NDP 2010 crew.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JsvasgbEuY...player_embedded

hehe, i've posted the link earlier this morning.. :P

No worries bro. Cheers.

Great vid , Alfie, I hv been posting it every where. :lol:

Screen shot of the side of Leo 2A4:

Screen shot of the side of Leo 2A4 EVO:


I took them to see whether there is armour plating at the top of the turret, anyway , it is not really conclusive, you guys be the judge.

2 years ago, a report from Germany that IBD Leo 2A4 EVO upgrade was a request from a particular customer, who has limitation of 60 metric tons for the upgrades.

That upgrades includes additional armour plating at the top of the turret as well as bottom of the hull for mine protection, AMAP-ADS is not part of it.

If Singapore was that customer, then the above should be included.

Now if SAF was the customer, I wonder why AMAP-ADS was not included.

Possible procurement from other sources instead?

That's because 2 yrs ago, the AMAP-ADS was only a prototype.

The ADS is identifiable by the 3 sensors which does not appear on the SAF L2A4s (including the pic by gary).

http://www.ibd-deisenroth-engineering.de/l...-evolution.html

Agree there is no AMAP-R roof either which is the extra layer on top as per gary's pic.

Having said that, the whole thing is modular ie it goes up when it needs to go up.

OPSSG posted a report on DT on STK putting up an AMAP-ADS onto a bronco in eurosatory 2008 (in 2008). If they were considering that for a less exp veh. That should already give a pretty good hint if that's going onboard the L2A4.

I don't think any defense systems should be mounted during public displays for safety reasons. Besides, its modular and can be added when needed. (Do we really need a whole stock of dummy defense systems for mass displays?)

The picture above shown IBD Leo 2A4, at the end of the turret, the 2 antennas do not appear to have a protruding antenna mount as they were probably flushed with the additional top armour plating.

Here another from the vid which clearing shown the antenna mount , probably indicating there is no top armour plating for SAF Leo 2.

Modern ATM is designed to kill the tank from the top and I suppose the army has a way to counter such threats. Armour plating can be designed around the antenna and mounted to the top when needed.

perhaps we know that our intended area of ops does not include top attack ATGM?

Yup, that could be one of the reasons.

Correct me If I am wrong , I don't think any armed forces in SEA has any top attack ATGM, the nearest are OZ and the Kiwis where they have Javelin ATGM.

Or it could be simply that SAF did not install them in public eyes, afterall, they are modular, it could be installed easily when needed.

excepting SAF of course which is the underlying assumption.

Sorry but where does the name "Leopard 2 EVO" comes from? Anyone has any idea what armour is that?

Ceramic composites and light metal alloys. Offers weight reduction factor 2 to 4 times that of steel armour.

Strengthened to STANAG 4569 / AEP 55 multi-hit requirements and is certificated at Levels 1-5 (highest). Level 5 would offer protection from 25mm M791s and 155mm arty at certified ranges. May be in excess of that (and possibly before existing L2A4 armour).

See AMAP-B brochure.

http://www.ibd-deisenroth-engineering.de/a...s_uk/AMAP-B.pdf

From the manufactuer of the upgrades.

http://www.ibd-deisenroth-engineering.de/l...-evolution.html

and it is based on their new modular armour upgrades, AMAP(Advanced Modular Armour Protection), which is even newer than MEXAS.

http://www.ibd-deisenroth-engineering.de/amap.html

The vid has been removed by the user and re-uploaded.

Here the new link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvH47ulDNAM

hmmm there is only one second difference in length but I notice the part where the encek control the BX2 to reverse has been removed, so something else was added.

I believe its the BX AVLB part between 2:10 to 2:18.

errrr .... can i point out something?

The AMAP-R addition (for the roof armour) was never designed to protect against Top-Attack ATGMs. Seriously, a few inches of add-on armour, over a base layer that is also only a few inches thick ... there is no way that thin sandwich is going to have a RHAe sufficient to protect against a a full blown ATGM on a top attack profile.

The AMAP-R package was meant for protection against top attack EFP such as those delivered by ICM bomblets or elevated IEDs.

So the speculation on why no AMAP-R was mounted on the NDP Leos is either ...

i) Fitted-for-but-not-with ;)
ii) Can't be bothered since our ersthwile adversary has signed the CCM Treaty

Nothing to do with Top-Attack ATGMs.

Very sharp eyes Gary!

Just different radio antenna, nothing more..

If you look carefully at how high the Commander independent sight sit and how high the cupola of both the commander and the loader sit, SAF version is the same as the trial tank... thus I think the same "top armour" has already been applied.

The only difference between SAF's Leo2A4 and the trial tank is the front facing turret armoured. The SAF's version has a flat surface whereas the trial version has slopped surface. I think the slopped one looks better, but wonder if it is also more effective as it may be able to deflect more energy away.

Hi Kotay, nice to see you.

Thanks for the information. I was wondering along the same lines but wasn't entirely certain.

I highly doubt anything can stop a top-attack ATGM or a Maverick for that matter. Hehe, just my opinion.

the upgrade seems to be by Rheinmetall. The Rheinmetall upgrade looks more alike to our leopards

http://www.rheinmetall-detec.com/index.php?fid=5371&lang=3

Actually they are basically the same family, Rheinmetall marketing the Revolution, also has a company called Rheinmetall Chempro which are 51% owned by Rheinmetall and 49% by the Deisenroth family(IBD), which the passive protection of Revolution are actually from IBD.

See this link, Rheinmetall Chempro marketing AMAP as well.

http://www.rheinmetall-chempro.com/index.php?lang=3

Leopard 2A4 MBT REVOLUTION.

http://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/index.php?fid=4626&lang=3

Climate control

An entirely new air conditioning and ventilation concept ensures maximum crew comfort even in warmer climates. Air conditioning and thermal insulation in the fighting compartment, coupled with optimum ventilation and separate cooling of the driver's compartment, result in a level of efficiency never attained before. Moreover, by ensuring that the ammunition on board remains fully functional, thermal insulation of the magazine contributes to operational safety. Thanks to intelligent control, the new climate control system automatically adapts to changing ambient conditions, assuring optimum use of energy. Simple cleaning and maintenance procedures are an added plus.

http://www.rheinmetall-detec.com/index.php?fid=5371&lang=3

cuz he guide vehicle with nothing more than a beret on?

well in an urban environment it might hold out against an RPG fired at it from above...

True, how often do you have Leo2 running down the streets in FIBUA/MOUT?

If we expect Leo2 to be involved in FIBUA, then the PSO kit would be wise

What made me think it was an IBD designed armour is the turret clips used to hold the modular pieces which seem to be similar and the anti-RPG rear fencing design.

if only Khai Yan were guiding the BX with nothing other than a beret :lol:

the encek not only only wear beret, he some more use one hand to tahan the BX2 from rolling forward. for opsec reasons we cannot let our adversaries know that our enceks have such super human powers :P

only when we see them running around with FIBUA colour swatches.

IBD EVO


and Austria 2A4( large picture , click to compare)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...4_Austria_6.JPG

And SAF Leo 2A4